Comments for Morocco: Amazigh rights issue pits Berbers against Islamists at http://www.moroccoboard.com , comment 1 to 14 out of 14 comments http://www.moroccoboard.com Sun, 14 Mar 2010 18:12:09 +0100 FeedCreator 1.7.3 http://www.moroccoboard.com/news/34-news-release/919-morocco-amazigh-rights-issue-pits-berbers-against-islamists#comment-4755 Kaoutar, Some people are using islam to keep Arabic predominant in Morocco. Most Amazighs are proud to be Muslims as they always have been. Please don't forget Imazighen's contribution of spreading Islam in Spain and West Africa. Also don't forget that the majority of the resistance during the French colonization was done by Imazighen (Abd lkrim in the rif, Moha ou Hammou in the Atlas, Ait Baamran in the Souss). Morocco's unity (pre 1912) was preserved around Islam. After the independence, Istiqlal party was trying to shift the balance between Arabic and Tamazight to the Panarabic ideology. That's when the Maghreb Al aqssa (the most westward Islamic country) to the Maghreb Arabe. As of the rest of your questions and concerns are all answered by Mohamed Chafiq (the first rector of the Institut royal de la culture amazighe) in the Amazigh Manifesto (5 days ago was its 10th years anniversary): http://www.amazighworld.org/human_rights/morocco/manifesto2000.php Bonne lecture! ... and Long live the diverse Morocco with Tamazight and Arabic as its official languages. - Hicham_M Fri, 05 Mar 2010 12:20:40 +0100 http://www.moroccoboard.com/news/34-news-release/919-morocco-amazigh-rights-issue-pits-berbers-against-islamists#comment-4747 my mum is a Berber from agadir my dad is a from asfi,i can speak berber,i consider my self as berber. let me tell u one thing though there is nothing more racists in Morocco than berbers my grandmother call my dad only a3rab witch is mean l3roobi and mum's family always showed this disrespect toward the Arabs and its not only in my family its such a common thing if Berbers have to rule one day in Morocco believe me the arabs wont have a single right so witch rights u talking abt,in Agadir most of ppls are berber u go to the hospitals all the stuff are Berbers in the schools is the same,why will we need translators for?? are we in Canada or something another thing Berbers are not able to communicate with each other,lets suppose we want to make berber official language in Morocco just tell me witch one we gonna pick?tashl7it tarifit or tamazight or .... berber think they better than arabs wich is a shame and the funny bit of ur article is when u relate arab culture to silam and berber culture to (no) islam i just told u guys beber are racist just becoz the prophet mohammed sw is an arab they dont admit he exists but i am glad not all the berbers think that deep so at least lets say lots of berber are more Muslims than many Arab anyway we don't want the Morocco u wanna make we dont need it we got enough things to sorts health care,corruption,education,come on think about things that will help the nation arabs and berbers and forget those pity things coz they not gonna lead us no where. - kaoutar Fri, 05 Mar 2010 03:57:34 +0100 http://www.moroccoboard.com/news/34-news-release/919-morocco-amazigh-rights-issue-pits-berbers-against-islamists#comment-4745 For the Amazigh citizens to gain their legitimate rights, the state would have to be separted from religion as a pre-requisite. Further, since classical Arabic has no native speakers, I believe that there would be no harm in making it the official language. Classical Arabic would safeguard and promote both Moroccan Arabic and Moroccan Berber cultures. As long as there is equal treatment and mutual respectin all spheres of government and society, "Moroccan" will bring us together-- and thus we can enjoy unity and harmony while mainting diversity. - Mohand Fri, 05 Mar 2010 02:59:14 +0100 http://www.moroccoboard.com/news/34-news-release/919-morocco-amazigh-rights-issue-pits-berbers-against-islamists#comment-4744 Stop your racism... that's what will divide Morocco. Morocco's unity was never centralized around Arabic. If that's what you want, I can tell you it won't be united for long. Who is talking about division? imagine if Morocco's only official language is Tamazight and your language and culture is totally ignored in the official realm. How would you feel? - Hicham_M Fri, 05 Mar 2010 02:53:06 +0100 http://www.moroccoboard.com/news/34-news-release/919-morocco-amazigh-rights-issue-pits-berbers-against-islamists#comment-4742 Stop your Bla Bla Bla Blaaaaaaaaaaaaaa!!enaugh is enaugh ,think of some constractive stuff anb be united.....or are trying hard to be an other Iraq(what divided iraq is not USA but it's poeple). My respect to all. - Fatima japan Thu, 04 Mar 2010 16:25:03 +0100 http://www.moroccoboard.com/news/34-news-release/919-morocco-amazigh-rights-issue-pits-berbers-against-islamists#comment-4741 berbers against islamists? o_O berbers are more religious than arabs and at least 50% of amazigh people don't speak their dialects, all the berber friends I have don't speak it, they don't care much about this arab/amazigh conflicts, they say we're muslims and moroccans. there are many berber dialects/languages so to recognize amazighi languages as official languages then we'll end up with five official languages. However, deprivinf certain groups of people from their culture, language, identity is unfair. I can't see why amazighi names are not allowed? that's plain stupid .. and concerning the translation in hospitals thing lol that was funny in a dramatic way because once you're in a moroccan hospital then just make tashahhud - Taha Thu, 04 Mar 2010 11:11:01 +0100 http://www.moroccoboard.com/news/34-news-release/919-morocco-amazigh-rights-issue-pits-berbers-against-islamists#comment-4739 Dear Hicham, Come on my friend, we all know why Dgherni created this "berber-jewish friendship" thing. And I v never heard of him making any activities with the Moroccan jews. The guy doesnt stop going to "israel" and gets bribed and then comes back here saying some stupid stuffs about how "israelis" are good people. Come on... "israelis" are good people???? U must be kidding me. He just exploits the feelings of both Arabs and Berbers to get to his own goals. And for me the Moroccan jews who went to Palestine are no more Morocans, they went there and invaded the Palestinian country and took places and lands f Palestinians. The Moroccan jews are the ones who are against israel and who stayed here cause they say they are Morocans and this is their country. Anyway, this is not our issue. I would like to share with you that these people who claim they are Berbers, they say that this is not Morocco and this is called some other name that I dont remember, and that only Berbers should be living here and that we Arabs have to go out of here :)I d love where to, but too bad I ve never met one of those to tell me where they want us to go :) And for the Dgherni guy, I think the authorities have to stop him somehow, and not let him go outside the country and take advantage of the situation. It is an internal affair and I beleive Berbers are too good to be represented bysuch low person :) Cheers. Amin - Amin BAGHDADI Wed, 03 Mar 2010 13:09:25 +0100 http://www.moroccoboard.com/news/34-news-release/919-morocco-amazigh-rights-issue-pits-berbers-against-islamists#comment-4713 Amin, Well it seems that we are in agreement! Unfortunately, the official rhetoric and the reality are totally different. Istiqlal Party and PJD, for example, are totally against any official aspect of Tamazight in Morocco. The first one is the historical panarabic party of Morocco and its dream of Arabizing the county is still vivid. PJD however, uses the old trick of making people believe that Arabic is a holly language; "it is the language of Paradise" and all that nonsense. The Quran is clear on this matter and never instructed humanity to ignore their values and culture to be replaced by the Arabic language or culture (Note that only 20% of muslims speak Arabic). What these parties fail to realize is the more they push, the more the amazigh people will push back. The longer these legal rights are ignored, the more radicalized the amazigh movement will become. That is just a reaction of people being fed up. As of Ahmed Drghreni, the man just want to fight and demand for these rights within the democratic process and the constitution. It is this same constitution that dismantled his party based on the article that says "No party should be created based on racial or religious basis". Mr. Drghreni claims that both istiqlal and PDJ were created based on those values. Also I do understand that some people are using his newly created Jewish-Amazigh friendship organization to claim that the Amazigh movement is receiving monies from Israel. Don't we have many Jewish/Moroccan organizations in Morocco? Aren't many Jewish people in Israel are Moroccan and many of them are Amazigh decent... don't we see many israelis of Moroccan decent come to Morocco to celebrate their Jewish holidays and TVM/2M are the first one present to show these celebration. So why the double standard? Respectfully, Hicham - Hicham_M Mon, 01 Mar 2010 14:48:59 +0100 http://www.moroccoboard.com/news/34-news-release/919-morocco-amazigh-rights-issue-pits-berbers-against-islamists#comment-4712 speaking Darija or tamazight does not necessarily mean that you are "Arab"or berbere". ethnically Moroccan are mostly "amazigh", there was a huge ethnic mixing through out history. even people who claim to be of "arab" origin are mostly amazigh if you undertake their DNA analysis. THE IS NO ETHNIC ISSUE IN MOROCCO. no ethnic strife per say. what the issue is all about : "do Moroccans want to recognize their own culture and civilization and be proud of it or are they going to go though history pretending to be " Arab" what they are not" ?. This question has nothing to do with religion. you can be of any religion regardless of what culture you are. the biggest catalysts for strife, instability, division is to marginalize a whole people, entire regions and deny their existence. that is the danger. Recognizing the obvious which is linguistic diversity is to contrary a building bloc of a strong nation. Ask any Middle Easterner, The first thing they will tell you "Moroccans are not Arab" and to that I always replay "amen" - Mohamed B. Mon, 01 Mar 2010 10:09:49 +0100 http://www.moroccoboard.com/news/34-news-release/919-morocco-amazigh-rights-issue-pits-berbers-against-islamists#comment-4711 I d like to thank you first for your prompt reply ;) But I dont think my head is in any sand. Or at least I dont let some specific minor groups put sand into my own eyes not to let me see the truth :) Anyway, please notice thta as an Arab, I fully support that the Tamazight language becomes a fully official language in Morocco all together with Arabic. That is a right that no one can deny. And I fully support that the Amazigh get the right to name their kids with Amazigh names that I really find very cute and nice :) I would love to name my kid if I get one with an Amazigh name. I knew some poeple who hold these names and they sound soooo good . For the problem of many Berbers who dont speak Arabic and who cant communicate in hospitals, offices, courthouses... That s a main thing to be done as well, and I know htat the government now is setting up a structure for providing translators in such cases. Please know that I beleive that everyone has to have equal rights here and I just love all Moroccans no matter what their background is ;) Now the big problem that I really fear is that some few people play the card of "discrimination against berbers" to create tensions between us, and in a country where people can easily be influenced, that can lead to a K.O as you know, and that is the thing that we least need :) Going to other countries and cry about that just to gain money is just pathetic and has to be fought with all means. EX: Ahmed Dgherni ;) I m sure u know what this guy is doing, and how much money he is gaining through the use of that issue and the use of many Berbers to achieve a political agande goals ;) P.S: I really have many Berber friends ;) haha Cheers. Amin - Amin Baghdadi Mon, 01 Mar 2010 09:25:58 +0100 http://www.moroccoboard.com/news/34-news-release/919-morocco-amazigh-rights-issue-pits-berbers-against-islamists#comment-4710 There are always some insecure and having personal agenda people who try to divide people .... Old british tech " divide and rule" they teach hate and discrimination .... Be JUST Morrocian ! - someone Mon, 01 Mar 2010 07:38:29 +0100 http://www.moroccoboard.com/news/34-news-release/919-morocco-amazigh-rights-issue-pits-berbers-against-islamists#comment-4707 "Even in Agadir, where Berbers are comparatively affluent and powerful, every day is a struggle, according to Amouzay. " Which Agadir are you talking about? The one I know it is the other way around. - Morcelli Mon, 01 Mar 2010 03:47:51 +0100 http://www.moroccoboard.com/news/34-news-release/919-morocco-amazigh-rights-issue-pits-berbers-against-islamists#comment-4705 With all due respect sir, I think your head is in the sand. Did you know you hail from a country where 30% of your countrymen and women don't speak Arabic? Yet they don't have any translators in Hospitals, courthouses, government offices...etc I'm glad people ARE taking advantage of the democratic era of Morocco to request their rights and sir the Amazigh movement won't stop until Tamazight becomes an official language of Morocco (of course beside Arabic... we do believe in equal rights after all). If you really believe that no matter what race you are, you should support this initiative. Since you claim to have many Amazigh friends, I would ask them to translate this for you: http://www.youtube.com/watch#v=sg-aK0Luj7k&feature=related respectfully, Hicham - Hicham_M Sun, 28 Feb 2010 17:19:43 +0100 http://www.moroccoboard.com/news/34-news-release/919-morocco-amazigh-rights-issue-pits-berbers-against-islamists#comment-4704 First, I d like to say that I dont oppose that above text because I dont like Berbers or that I m racist or anything in case anyone would beleive so :) I m a Moroccan Arab person and proud of it, and most my friends are Berbers and I m so proud of that too. Hopefully we ve never had these ethnic/race issues because we just consider ourselves Moroccans first and all gathered under the flag of one religion.And I really disliked the way the author of that text tried to disassociate Berbers from being Islamic, all Moroccan Berbers are Muslims and being Berber and Muslim is not contradictory. Morocco is a society that is made up with both Arabas and Berbers who are the first inhabitants of this glorious land, and that s a fact that we all know and appreciate. That is even the first thing that all pupils in Morocco learn once getting to school :) Concerning what some of the people who claim that they represent the Amazigh in their daily fight or whatever, I dont think there is any racial discrimination made against Berbers in Morocco. And if one says so, that would be just pure lies that anyone visiting Morocco would clearly notice. In here everyone faces the same problems and takes advantage of the same opportunities when provided. No Berber has never ever been denied work/education or any pther right in Morocco for belonging to that ethnic group. That s not the case for Arabs neither. We just all live in the same conditions. There are rich Arabs and rich Berbers, Poor Arabas and poor Berbers. Berbers are in the crucial government ,economic, social positions. Unfortunately there are some take advntage of the Democratic era that Morocco is creating today and play the race card in order to gain some personal satisfaction, but I really doubt this could work in a country like Morocco where these two races have been cohabitating fo centuries and who are now sharing everything even blood by getting married from each sides. Hoping that the minds will find one day their clear way to realize that we are all one, no matter what the race is, I hope that we Arabs and Berbers will still take advantage of the chance we have living side by side in one country that is known for its cultral plurality and diversification :) WE LOVE U MOROCCO :) - Amin Baghdadi Sun, 28 Feb 2010 14:49:34 +0100